This is a piece I wrote for the Alice in Wonderland ballet (for those who have already listened to the first piece, "L'ingresso dei fiori" [The Entrance of the Flowers], which I posted on another forum, this is the sequel...); the piece has precise indications imposed on me by the client: a bright piece, duration around 3 minutes, a more melodic central part, and a sharp closing because the dancers need to take their applause at the end of the piece....
I created it with Finale2011 and the EWQLSO Platinum plus library. My PC is an i3 with 6 GB of RAM and a 2.93 GHz processor, and it struggles a bit to manage all these samples together, but fortunately, it doesn't crash.
The audio is raw; it is what comes out of Finale, compressed in .mp3 for space reasons, otherwise the .wav file would have been 29 MB and could not be posted. I plan to have a professional do the mastering for me and perhaps steal a few trade secrets from them.
Obviously, it's not just a matter of writing, but also of editing the usual parameters that make a performance more realistic; however, all in all, Finale can also be used as a sequencer....
I thank everyone for the compliments. I wanted to ask for an opinion on what can be improved at an audio level: keeping in mind that the mp3 is much worse than the .wav format, but even the wav does not fully satisfy me. I am starting from the assumption that my listening is via headphones and in headphones it seems satisfactory, whereas in various sound systems it seems like something is missing; there should be more presence, bass with more punch, and brighter highs, but working only with equalization, I do not get the desired results. Could someone with more experience in the sector tell me how to improve the audio during the mastering phase? I have Ozone 5 Advanced as mastering software, but rather than proceeding by trial and error or applying various presets, I can't manage; I know it can be done better because I have heard tracks of terrifying audio quality from people working with the same tools as mine.
Ps.: the dance hasn't been created yet, they are still putting together the choreographies, the first one will be in June.
Salvo as an audio file directly from Finale, then I use Nero to convert it to .mp3 for space reasons when I have to post on a site or send a demo via email, so the audio you heard is exactly my own listening, without effects, without compression, without equalization.
I tried working with a mastering program, but I don't know how to use it because the quality doesn't improve that much....
Ok so from Finale you pull out the complete and assembled file.... And I don't blame you for not being happy with the result.
Finale and company are music notation software, they are not production software. To produce, you should use Pro Tools, Cubase or Logic.
If you have a way to save track by track (from the beginning to the end of the music, including any initial silences, so that they are assembled from second 0 and everything matches), and you send them to me, I will do a mastering for you.
So the ideal would be to work on every single track for every instrument? But it's a huge job, there will be more than twenty tracks... is it not possible to do something on the overall audio file? Anyway, I can record each track by putting it in solo and saving, maybe I'll try that.
Anyway, aside from this, could you tell me roughly what the various steps for a good mastering might be? Thanks.
Well, it's one thing to equalize a file composed of multiple tracks, and another thing to work on a single track and then apply effects to the entire project. There is much more management possibility. Furthermore, it is possible to use a bit of pan to set the position of the instruments in the orchestra, give spatiality, and direct the sounds. There are many more things that can be done...
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Zazza
Member
Reply 14 by Zazza
Posts
250
Natan wrote:
I also heard the first part, good blood doesn't lie.
I want to say one thing to those who might be interested in the subject of orchestration: the advice I feel compelled to give is to work with the best libraries possible, since it is extremely difficult to have a real orchestra with which to test various solutions. Libraries like Garritan mask everything a bit, both the good things and the bad; I believe I have improved greatly in orchestration, which was my weak point as the good Maestro Altieri knows, precisely since I started practicing with these libraries with more realistic sounds. They act as a stimulus; it's like playing on a 3-meter Steinway rather than an upright piano—on the Steinway, you would never stop.
The drawbacks are that they cost quite a lot, require a very powerful PC, and are rather complex to manage, but once the initial difficulties are overcome, I assure you they are a unique satisfaction (for those who find satisfaction in orchestrating, obviously; perhaps someone writes only for piano and doesn't care much about the orchestra). Of course, you also need foundations, knowledge for arranging and orchestrating, but there is also the aspect of fantasy and experimentation that is strongly stimulated and rewarded if, when you write something for violins, you then feel that the reproduction is similar to real violins...
Aside from having enjoyed your piece, which is very beautiful ... especially a worthy follow-up to the already delightful "entrance of the flowers"
geppino12575 wrote:
it is extremely difficult to have a real orchestra with which to rehearse various solutions.
This is something that conservatories should really fight for; it is unthinkable to train composers without providing them with due support in these terms.
It is also true that fortunately, during the three-year and two-year periods, one can take elective courses from faculties other than composition, so it is easier to come across an orchestra and real instrumentalists... then you can always look
[...] working on the single track [...] it is possible to use a bit of pan to define the position of the instruments in the orchestra, give spatiality and direct the sounds
to me with headphones it sounds very good, but one thing that could definitely be improved would be widening the stereophonic spectrum, because it seems a bit squashed in the center.
it is something you can try to do even with Ozone on the complete file (without working on every single track if it's too much hassle). There is a specific function, I don't remember the procedure but it was simple.
speaking of EWQLSO, are you able to adjust the attacks of the strings (which are often very slow) by working on the plugin controls ??
maybe I have already asked you but I lost the answer ....
On the panning and volumes, I can also act from Finale; it's very easy, so would you "widen" it a bit?
For the violin attacks, I use different samples for staccato and legato; furthermore, there are dxf samples that, by acting on the modulation lever, allow you to change the attack. They are very useful because with a single sample you can make a phrase either melodic or a bit more rhythmically marked. Anyway, for the strings, I use at least two samples for each of the 5 parts—vl1, vl2, vla, vc, and cb—sometimes even 3, also considering the pizzicato, so about fifteen MIDI channels are used just for the strings. I don't use keyswitch samples much because they are very heavy and I don't make full use of all the samples; I find it better to switch between MIDI channels rather than between KS, although they are useful when needed.
ah there we go, I'll try, I had never given a damn about dxf files
si, I would widen it a bit, I can't guarantee the result but you can try, also because I imagine that the overall effect is a bit different from simply changing the pan on the tracks (which those sounds should already have their own natural pan anyway).
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stuyvesaint
Member
Reply 20 by stuyvesaint
Posts
28
everything is fine, as you have already been told panpotta raises the bass volume a little bit. If you have ozone, use the gentle tube preset which is already luxurious (great).
