Modulation

It is a modulation to closely related keys, so you have a great number of possibilities. However, the most used and, if we want, the simplest one is to pass through the dominant seventh of the new key, namely the seventh built on the V degree of the B-flat minor key... More complex methods are, for example, the enharmonic of the diminished seventh, but this is only used when modulating between distant keys, whatever they may be, also because it is not a very smooth and pleasant passage to the ear even if harmonically correct; therefore, this method is always left as a last chance when other methods cannot be applied. Other modulation methods are on the IV descending to the III and on the V ascending to the VI, or the so-called "fan method" based on the circle of fifths (ascending or descending / major or minor keys); there is still the possibility of adopting the secondary dominant, but this is a separate case that has nothing to do with what you need to do. If you are at the beginning, I advise you to use the first one I mentioned; it is the simplest and the most natural to the ear. NB: The method of the dominant seventh of the new key is only valid for modulations to closely related keys and cannot be applied to keys that are distant from each other! Closely related keys are understood as keys that are no more than 1# or 1b away from the original key, or its relative minor. E.g., C Maj -> G Maj, or C Maj - F Maj, or C Maj - E min, or C Maj - D min, or finally C Maj - A min.

I do not know your level of preparation; I am writing you a simple table to learn by heart with all 30 keys, including enharmonic equivalents and relative key signatures:

C# Major - A# Minor --> 7# (Enharmonic to Db Major and Bb Minor)

F# Major - D# Minor --> 6# (Enharmonic to Gb Major and Eb Minor)

B Major - G# Minor --> 5# (Enharmonic to Cb Major and Ab Minor)

E Major - C# Minor --> 4#

A Major - F# Minor --> 3#

D Major - B Minor --> 2#

G Major - E Minor --> 1#

C Major - A Minor --> 0

F Major - D Minor --> 1b

Bb Major - G Minor --> 2b

Eb Major - C Minor --> 3b

Ab Major - F Minor --> 4b

Db Major - Bb Minor --> 5b (Enharmonic to C# Major and A# Minor)

Gb Major - Eb Minor --> 6b (Enharmonic to F# Major and D# Minor)

Cb Major - Ab Minor --> 7b (Enharmonic to B Major and G# Minor)

As you can see, there are some enharmonic keys; it is interesting to draw the circle of fifths to better understand what happens.

If you don't know how to perform the modulation, let me know and I will try to post some images of modulation on a staff in your case.

GoodLife wrote:

moving from E-flat minor to B-flat minor, thanks 🙂

The first necessary question is whether you are thinking of modulating, therefore writing an episode in the fourth degree of Bb-, or simply tonicizing and thus only "underlining" the fourth degree?

Sorry, but what is the difference between modulating and tonicizing? What do you mean by emphasizing?

Gennarino wrote:

Sorry, but what is the difference between modulating and tonicizing? What do you mean by emphasizing?

I'll chime in

Modulation is a more or less long process that leads to arriving at and using a new key... tonicization is just a temporary modulation, usually a secondary dominant is used, which ends with the (precisely) tonicized chord.

If we are in C+, using D7 I tonicize the G+ chord... if afterwards I return to the chords and degrees of C+, it was a tonicization; if I stay in G+ and begin to make the degrees of the new key heard... then it was a modulation.

I hope this is clearer

moving from Eb minor to Bb minor

I would have done it like this

Starting Eb minor > via F+7 > arriving at Bb-

You can also do it modally: given the affinity of the two keys, a single passage through the harmonic minor scale of one is enough to "prepare" the other.

If in Eb you use the Dorian mode instead (that is, with C instead of B natural, i.e., the augmented sixth), then it is more spontaneous to pass through the first species seventh on the V (that is, F major with its minor 7th).

To move from Eb minor to the V of Bb (F7), you can try the diminished chord on Eb (Eb/Gb/Bbb/C).

CromaDiBrera wrote:

You can also do it modally: given the affinity of the two keys, a single step through the harmonic minor scale of one is enough to "prepare" the other.

If in Eb you use the Dorian mode instead (that is, with C instead of B natural, i.e., the augmented sixth), then it is more spontaneous to pass through the first species seventh on the V (that is, F major with its minor 7th).

To move from Eb minor to the V of Bb (F7), you can try the diminished chord on Eb (Eb/Gb/Bbb/C).

just to be clear, you would do better to give the notes the right names!

1) B natural??? you must mean C flat

2) augmented sixth??? perhaps you mean an raised sixth degree (as a side note, if you are referring to the interval rather than the degree, Eb-C is a MAJOR 6th)

3) diminished chord on Eb (Eb/Gb/Bbb/C)??? why that Bbb? could it be an A natural, which might also be useful as a leading tone for Bb minor...

robertoaltieri wrote:

to be clear, you'd better give the sounds the right name!

1) B natural??? you must mean C flat

But sir, Maestro, did you read our friend's post correctly...? Of course, of course: it is a C flat.

robertoaltieri wrote:

2) augmented sixth??? do you perhaps mean an augmented sixth degree (as a side note, if you are referring to the interval rather than the degree, Eb-C is a MAJOR 6th)

An augmented degree, if not major or minor, can also be called augmented: in Piston there is an entire chapter on modulation with the augmented sixth (in the last Italian edition, it is chap. 27). And, in the first movement of Haydn's Sonata Hob. XVI/37 (the last one, otherwise known as no. 52 in Eb major), between measures 45 and 46 there is a modulation with the augmented sixth. Starting from the bass, three flats in the key signature, strong beat: Bb/octave/D/F; weak beat: Ab/octave/C/F#; strong beat of the following measure: G/octave/Bb natural/G. To cite one of the simplest uses, even if not among those you can verify in the aforementioned manual, which is rich with many other examples.

robertoaltieri wrote:

3) diminished chord on Eb (Eb/Gb/Bbb/C)??? why that Bbb? could it perhaps be an A natural, which might also be useful as a leading tone for Bb minor...

What do you mean, and what are we doing...? "sometimes for turkeys and sometimes for crickets" [meaning: being inconsistent]? If it is a diminished chord on Eb, it seems to me that the fifth is indeed a Bbb and not an A natural. So: you correct my "B natural" on Eb minor... but instead, on a diminished Eb, the fifth becomes an A natural...?!?! Excuse me, but are you orthodox whenever it suits you, as they say in my parts...?

In my example, we are not yet in Bb minor; therefore, it does not yet make sense to indicate an A double flat as the leading tone of the tonic of the arrival chord. Don't you think?

And besides, excuse me, but I wouldn't use certain tones ("you'd better etc."), esteemed Prof. Atieri, seeing as at least two out of three of your reprimands are absolutely debatable; all the more so since I can take into account that I might also be wrong in indicating a B natural to a beginner instead of a C flat (which, anyway, was just to clarify a moment on the keyboard, for heaven's sake... if that's the case, I wrote B natural, not B natural [unaltered], which would be different...). You don't.

raffaeleb wrote:

moving from Eb minor to Bb minor

I would have done it like this

Starting Eb minor > Via F+7 > Arriving Bb-

The point is that the modulation could also be done without passing chords; eb- is already the triad built on the fourth degree of bb- .... the plagal cadence exists

CromaDiBrera wrote:

But you, Maestro, did you read our friend's post correctly...? Of course, that wouldn't be possible: it is a D-flat.

An raised degree, if not augmented or diminished, can also be called augmented: in Piston there is an entire chapter on modulation with the augmented sixth (in the latest Italian edition, it is chap. 27). And, in the first movement of Haydn's Sonata Hob. XVI/37 (the last one, otherwise known as no. 52 in E-flat major), between measures 45 and 46 there is a modulation with the augmented sixth. Starting from the bass, three flats in the key, strong beat: Bb/octave/D/F; weak beat: Ab/octave/C/F-double-sharp; strong beat of the following measure: G/octave/Bb-natural/G. To cite one of the simplest uses, even if not among those you can verify in the aforementioned manual, which is rich in many other examples.

But what, and what are we doing...? "when to quails and when to crickets"...? If it is a diminished chord on E-flat, it seems to me that the fifth is precisely a B-double-flat and not an A-natural. So: you correct my "B-natural" on E-flat minor... and instead, on a diminished E-flat, the fifth becomes an A-natural...?!?! Excuse me, but are you orthodox whenever it suits you, as they say in my parts...?

In my example, we are not yet in B-flat minor; therefore, it does not yet make sense to indicate an A-natural as the leading tone of the tonic of the arrival chord. Don't you think?

And besides, excuse me, but I would not use certain tones ("you had better etc.",), esteemed Prof. Atieri, since at least two out of three of your reprimands are absolutely debatable; all the more so because I can take into account that I might also be wrong in indicating to a beginner a B-natural instead of a C-flat (which, by the way, was just intended to clarify a moment on the keyboard, for heaven's sake... if that's the case, I wrote B-natural, not B-natural [unaltered], which would be different...).
You cannot.

So, let's go in order...

- feel free to use the informal "tu" as everyone does here; I don't care to be called Maestro in the forums I participate in.

- I apologize if I used tones that were too peremptory, as if I were addressing an undiligent student, but reading 3 (THREE!) nonsense statements in a few lines must have annoyed me slightly.

- as for my reprimands,

1) I don't understand what the augmented sixth chord has to do with the raised VI degree (C-natural) you were talking about. I know Piston's book very well: it speaks, like all other harmony manuals (its only invention is the "Swiss" augmented 6th), of chords built on the minor VI degree with a note at an augmented 6th distance (or augmented, if you will) from that one, i.e., a IV+ augmented. Haydn's example is perfectly fine (that indeed is an augmented 6th). In your case, however, I continue not to understand: what would the C-natural be an augmented 6th of? Of E-flat??

2) regarding the diminished 7th chord on E-flat, I should say to you "when to quails and when to crickets": first you called the D-double-flat B-natural to make yourself understood better, and here you call the A-natural B-double-flat to make yourself understood worse?

And then, why is it that if you want a dim. 7th on the I degree, you don't call the 7th B-double-flat, but C? With B-double-flat, it would result in a chord on the leading tone of the lowered II degree, something very abstruse but theoretically possible.

What you wrote, instead, is the 1st inversion of a chord that has the VI+ as its fundamental: what sense should that have? Of the leading tone of the natural VII? It could also be that, if we really want to make things difficult...

It would be, instead, much more logical (and more understandable) the E-flat G-flat A-C chord, which is the 2nd inversion of the diminished 7th chord of the IV+ of E-flat minor. That's all.

CromaDiBrera wrote:

And besides, excuse me, but I would not use certain tones ("you had better etc."), esteemed Prof. Atieri, since at least two out of three of your reprimands are absolutely debatable; all the more so because I can take into account that I might also be wrong, in indicating a B natural instead of a C flat to a beginner (which, by the way, was just to get an idea for a moment on the keyboard, for heaven's sake... if that's the case, I wrote B natural, not B double natural, which would be different...). You cannot.

i forgot the last pearl:

please explain to me, what is the substantial difference between B natural and B double natural?

but what is the problem with admitting you were wrong?

we can all make mistakes, even I! (very rarely, of course)

robertoaltieri wrote:

1) I don't understand what the augmented sixth chord with the raised VI degree (C natural) that you were talking about has to do with it. I know Piston's book very well: it speaks, like all other harmony manuals (his only invention is the "Swiss" augmented 6th), of chords built on the minor VI degree with a note at an augmented sixth distance (or augmented, if you will) from that one, i.e., a IV+. Haydn's example works perfectly (that truly is an augmented 6th). In your case, however, I still don't understand: what would C natural be an augmented 6th of? Of Eb??

No, in fact it was a major sixth; I was wrong. It happens. My response only concerned the fact that a sixth could not be augmented (and diminished), but only minor or major, as it seemed to me you had objected. I have no problem admitting mistakes.

robertoaltieri wrote:

2) regarding the diminished 7th chord on Eb, should I say to you "when to talk to turkeys and when to talk to crickets": first you called Dob B natural to make yourself understood better, and here you call A natural Bbb to make yourself understood worse?

Here, however, I don't think I was wrong: in indicating the note on the keyboard to a boy who is probably simply harmonizing a motif without having deep knowledge, it seemed more intuitive to me to indicate B natural instead of C flat. In the chord, however, I believed I was emphasizing that the diminished fifth degree was, as it is, a Bb.

robertoaltieri wrote:

And then, why if you want a dim. 7th on the I degree, do you not call the 7th Bbb, but C? With Bbb it would result in a chord on the leading tone of the lowered II degree, something very abstruse but theoretically possible.

For the same reason why I didn't call it a seventh of the fifth species... I indicated C enharmonically to highlight that it was a note of the V of Bb; I understand that it may appear contradictory to you, and certainly incorrect, but I thought it would be more intuitive for my interlocutor.

robertoaltieri wrote:

It would, instead, be much more logical (and more understandable) the Eb-Gb-Bb-C chord, which is the 2nd inversion of the diminished 7th chord of the IV+ of Eb minor. That's all.

I understand that, if I defined A as Bbb, I should have followed the same criterion for Bbb = C. But, if it's not soup... Perhaps, speaking of the 2nd inversion of the diminished VII of the IV is not actually much more understandable... No?

I wasn't so careful about "calling things by the right name," because I thought that the thread author had a "visual" approach to the keyboard (or the guitar) at an amateur level; there are also those who are content with playing three chords to compose a song, and if you tell them "VII of the IV," or C flat instead of B, they already change the channel... Otherwise, as someone observed, I think they wouldn't have had problems making a plagal cadence.

Sorry, I forgot:

robertoaltieri wrote:

i forgot the last gem: could you please explain to me the substantial difference between B natural and B natural (B natural with a natural sign)?

Of course: in the first case, I am referring to the little finger pressing the key, which if you ask a child "what note is this?" they will answer "it's a B" and not "it's a C flat"; in the second, instead, to the harmonic function of the note, therefore to its correct notation (which would be, instead, C flat). And to me, having to explain the difference seems like a gem itself.

Dear CromaDiBrera,

it honors you to recognize that you were wrong regarding the augmented sixth. I find you more likable now (before I had the impression that you just wanted to be right at all costs).

On the other matters, including the difference between C natural and C flat, I continue to disagree with you, but it doesn't seem worth arguing over something so small: everyone has expressed their reasons and no one is forcing us to compromise.

Rather, I wonder what happened to GoodLife... They make us bicker over a piece of advice they asked for and then they disappear!

GoodLife, if you are there, give us a sign! Did you finish that modulation? Let us know how it went

robertoaltieri wrote:

Rather, I wonder what happened to GoodLife... They make us scramble for a piece of advice they asked for and then they disappear!

GoodLife, if you're here, give us a sign! Did you pull off that modulation? Let us know how

... maybe they ran away (hihihi), thought they were asking something simple with 3 acronyms but instead realized the matter is quite a bit more complex

robertoaltieri wrote:

Regarding other matters, including the difference between C natural and C flat, I continue to disagree with you, but I don't think it's worth arguing over such a small thing: everyone has expressed their reasons and no one is forcing us to compromise.

Right. I will try to be more careful, regardless of my interlocutor (who must have stayed in Eb, I presume... Maybe it was the new Dylan...! ).

They have said many things...... secondary dominants are passing modulations..... harmonic progressions are chords in a harmonic sequence with chords that can belong to the same key or to different keys. ....in the first case the progression does not modulate, in the second it modulates. ....the modulation may or may not return to the original key. ...and substitutions are temporary modulations,..... chord alterations are not modulations.....................and so on. There are those who say that modulation does not exist if it is passing, those who say the opposite, those who say that secondary dominants are not modulations, those who say they are, those who say that substitutions are modulations, those who say no........!.........!... my personal opinion, in an attempt to approach your discussions, is that a modulation exists, regardless of whether it is short or not. the moment there is a change of key, which is when a II-V appears that converges toward a I located in another key, meaning its triad is not included among the triads of the scale of the song's key.. It is not necessary for the I to be played; the key is determined by the tritone of the V. Therefore, I do not consider the substitution of the V to be modulating because the terminal triad, that is the I, is the same. I do not consider secondary dominants to be modulating since they resolve on a triad that is part of the scale of the base key. Regarding modulation, in my opinion, the most important aspect, which is not written anywhere, is NOT to consider as modulating all tonal situations that leave the base key and that are part of a cyclic system or one converging toward the tonic triad of the song's key.. Let me explain better with some examples. The chord sequence of Night and Day (Real Book version in C), both in A and in B from the 8th to the 16th bar, CONVERGES toward the base C, so it is not modulating; Coltrane changes are not modulating since the tonal centers travel CYCLICALLY by major thirds to return to the starting key: C-Ab-E-C. Convergent and cyclic systems are tonal variants whose progression is PREDICTABLE and has a very precise direction, namely the cadential movement toward the reference tonal gravity of the song, otherwise defined as the key. Modulation, especially if done during an improvisation, must be UNPREDICTABLE because it can be inserted unexpectedly into any tonal key outside of teleologically oriented structures that have a cyclic character (Coltrane changes) or non-cyclic character (Night and Day). Imagine if during the improvisation of The "days of wine and roses" instead of Bb-7 and Eb7 we insert Eb-7 and Ab7 or Gb-7 and Cb7; the sense doesn't change much because ultimately modulation aims to create tension, and tension can be created in many other ways. In convergent or cyclic systems, however, the direction is mandatory. This reduces the tension-relaxation element and takes away meaning from the concept and the realization of "modulation."

http://www.armoniamodale.blogspot.it/search?updated-min=2012-01-01T00:00:00%2B01:00&updated-max=2013-01-01T00:00:00%2B01:00&max-results=26

http://ettoregarzia.blogspot.it/

modale wrote:

my personal opinion, in an attempt to align myself with your discussions, is that a modulation exists, regardless of whether it is short or not. at the moment there is a change of key, which is when a II-V appears that converges toward a I located in another key, meaning its triad is not included among the triads of the scale of the song's key..

the vast majority of harmony and analysis scholars in the world call this "tonicization". Which is, precisely, the highlighting of typical characteristics of a key different from the home key.

It is not necessary for the I to be played; the key is determined by the tritone of the V.

it is just a matter of terminology. From what I seem to understand from your other posts, yours is a jazz background and perhaps you are used to speaking of modulation even for phenomena of this type. But rather than saying you are wrong, I think it makes sense to say that your description is correct IF referred to tonicization. In tonicization, for example, there is no need to cadence on the tonic; the characteristics of the new key are enough, such as, indeed, the leading tone loaded with tension. In this sense, I emphasize that the tritone in the V does not exist; it only exists in the V7. And indeed, as a jazz musician, I gather that you take the presence of the seventh on a dominant chord for granted :-) in classical harmony this is not taken for granted at all, and the tension degree par excellence is the leading tone.

I do not therefore consider the substitution of the V to be modulating because the terminal triad, that is the I, is the same.

when you speak of substitution, you are speaking of substitution in jazz harmony, I imagine. In terms of classical harmony, we would not speak of substitution but of the use of a "simple" Neapolitan second chord. That is, a chord built on the second degree of a Neapolitan minor scale. Chords like the Neapolitan are traditionally considered foreign chords but not modulating ones. The criterion at the base of substitution, among other things, gives that chord a function different from what it would have in classical tonal harmony, where the triad and tetrad built on the second degree of the Neapolitan scale function as subdominants, so much so that in functional theory they are also seen as major contrachords of minor subdominants (but this is complex...).

I do not consider secondary dominants to be modulating since they resolve to a triad that is part of the scale of the home key.

but, according to harmonic theory, they remain foreign chords because they have foreign sounds within them. And it is also for this reason that the concept of tonicization was born.

Regarding modulation, in my opinion, the most important aspect, which is not written anywhere, is NOT to consider as modulating all tonal situations that leave the home key and that are part of a cyclic or convergent system toward the tonic triad of the song's key..

... actually, at least what you say IS written; Schoenberg based an entire harmonic treatise on the concept of expanded tonality and harmonic constellation... the idea being that every key has in its harmonic baggage a series of chords not necessarily formed by the degrees of its scale.

I will explain myself better with some examples. The chord sequence of Night and Day (Real Book version in C), both in A and in B from the 8th to the 16th bar, CONVERGES toward the base C, so it is not modulating; Coltrane changes are not modulating since the tonal centers travel CYCLICALLY by major thirds to return to the starting key: C-Ab-E-C. Convergent and cyclic systems are tonal variants whose progression is PREDICTABLE and has a very precise direction, namely the cadential progression toward the reference tonal gravity of the song, otherwise defined as the key. Modulation, especially if done during an improvisation, must be UNPREDICTABLE because it can be inserted by surprise into any tonal key outside of teleologically oriented structures that have a cyclic character (Coltrane changes) or non-cyclic character (Night and Day). Imagine if during the improvisation of The "days of wine and roses" instead of Bb-7 and Eb7 we insert Eb-7 and Ab7 or Gb-7 and Cb7, the meaning doesn't change much because ultimately modulation aims to create tension, and tension can be created in many other ways. In convergent or cyclic systems, however, the direction is mandatory. This reduces the tension-relaxation element and removes meaning from the concept and the realization of "modulation".

http://www.armoniamo...&max-results=26

http://ettoregarzia.blogspot.it/

in terms of

classical harmony is all quite simple, I believe. Tonicization is the highlighting of elements (often chromatic notes but also harmonic successions) typical of a key different from the home key. Modulation, on the other hand, is the path of negation of a starting key until the affirmation of a new key, through the use of strong cadential structures (especially perfect cadence)

Interesting discussion, difficult to add anything ...