House walls and piano acoustics.... which materials?

Hi Silvia.

You were well advised to create a drywall partition interspersed with rock wool. The rock wool is positioned between the existing wall and the drywall, therefore it does not contribute to making the environment drier, but rather to soundproofing the environment from the outside, i.e., limiting the noises perceived outside the room.

thesimon wrote:

13 hours ago, thesimon said:

Hi Silvia.

You were well advised to create a plasterboard wall interspersed with rock wool. The rock wool is placed between the existing wall and the plasterboard one; therefore, it does not contribute to making the environment drier, but rather to soundproofing the environment from the outside, i.e., limiting the noise perceived outside the room. 

 

hi Simone, first of all thanks for the answer.... maybe I didn't express myself very clearly.... the room should be divided in two, so there is currently no wall at that point....

to make less mess during the work, they suggested padded plasterboard to me, so we wouldn't have to clear everything out.... it's just that I wonder.... do you think the acoustics would be better if, instead of padded plasterboard, I had a hollow block wall built?.... 

I say this as an engineer in a completely different field, but there are several engineering and architecture studies that have experience in acoustic insulation.

Acoustic insulation and acoustic treatment of an environment are two completely different things. By putting up sound-absorbing panels, it is true that you insulate a little, but that is not their purpose. Paradoxically, if you make a floating floor and place marble slabs on top of the MDF, you would obtain a room with decent reverberation but acoustically insulated.

Besides, there are stone speakers on the market http://www.musicalstones.com/index.html

mike71 wrote:

1 hour ago, mike71 said:

Soundproofing and acoustic treatment of a room are two completely different things

Yes exactly, I don't care about "insulating".... I would just like to have the best possible acoustics inside the room.... for this reason I was wondering if the sound would "reverberate" better on hollow blocks or alternatively on plasterboard panels..... since I have to divide the room in two, maybe I'll opt for the best solution....

so from what I understand, the harder the material, the better the reverb will be?.... well at this point I'll opt to divide the room with a classic hollow block wall....

The colleague has already replied to you...

Acoustic insulation is one thing, the acoustic treatment of a room is something else entirely...

In insulation, heavy and/or porous materials are used in combination. The pairing of these types of material serves to dissipate the vibrating energy of the sound wave. As far as the internal acoustics of the hall are concerned, and here we enter the field of acoustic treatment, there is little difference between a drywall wall and a stone wall. In the sense that the reverberation time depends on the Sabine coefficient (that is, the reflection coefficient of the walls) which refers solely to the material upon which the sound wave impacts. In terms of surface density, there isn't much difference between a wall made with hollow bricks and a drywall wall. If you then want to solve the acoustic problems of the room, there are other strategies to undertake, including: bass traps, vibrating panels, sound absorbers, 2D and 3D Schroeder diffusers, etc., etc. Clearly, the use of these solutions depends on the problems to be solved. Therefore, to do things properly, the room must be measured with an impulse signal containing all frequencies that simulates what is colloquially called a Dirac Delta, and from there, all the spectral components that generate problems are analyzed, which can be: comb filters, also called comb filters, which are themselves due to standing waves created along the three dimensions of the room, as well as the reverberation time. Depending on the frequencies at play, certain solutions are chosen, but I repeat, they must be carefully selected by competent personnel.

Obviously, I don't think you need to build a control room, so I don't think you have the need to spend a lot of money to achieve as flat a listening experience as possible; therefore, to solve any echoing problems, you can opt for much simpler DIY solutions, for example by putting a nice large heavy rug in the room. If a sofa fits, or if there are windows, you can insert curtains made of very heavy velvet which work very well. Clearly, add one piece at a time until you achieve the echo you prefer. Keep in mind that adding all these things in one solution could generate a listening experience that is too dry, which does not pair well with the sound of the piano.

In the previous response I was in a bit of a hurry; I hope I have been a little more precise in this one.

I wouldn't know but, on the contrary, since we removed the curtains, rugs, and sofas yesterday, the acoustics seem to please me more.... Could it just be a temporary impression of mine?

I don't know what this might correspond to in recording, but I think that in my case, what I perceive while playing is definitely more important than what the microphone will perceive? The piano itself is very dark... the full forte is not bothersome....

thesimon wrote:

14 hours ago, thesimon said:

In my previous response I was in a bit of a hurry, I hope to have been a little more precise in this one.

Don't worry, you expressed yourself very clearly, thanks again ?

Silviaa wrote:

10 hours ago, Silviaa said:

I wouldn't know but, on the contrary, since we took down the curtains, removed the rugs and the sofas yesterday, the acoustics seem to please me more.... Could it just be a temporary impression of mine?

I don't know what this might correspond to in recording, but I think that in my case, what I perceive while playing is definitely more important than what the microphone will perceive? The piano itself is very dark... the full forte doesn't bother me....

But indeed, the point I was making in my previous message referred mainly to this. Personally, I don't like the dry sound of the piano at all, but it's also not pleasant when excessively reverberated. There must be a right compromise. Not by chance are the most beautiful concert halls in the world famous because, in that acoustic context, the sound of the instruments resonates in a very pleasing way to the ear (which is not easy to achieve in large rooms) because there is a series of latency phenomena due to the delay in the early reflections which, instead, are bothersome.

To take it to the extreme, playing in an anechoic chamber would make you want to leave as soon as possible, because you would hear the sound of the piano very differently from how you are used to hearing it. The same goes for playing inside a cave.

In medium stat virtus, as the Romans used to say! ?

Good evening and good music...