How Beethoven treats variations

Luca, which opera were you referring to?

First of all… here I am!

It's great, Frank, that you opened a discussion on such a tough topic, giving "proper venue" to some ideas that blossomed in the other discussion (the one that is now called "Variations" for a friend's sake). As I was saying there, I don't mind going off-topic when it leads to new, beautiful and interesting themes. It's a bit like searching in a mine: you look for something, and you find something else too; just as good, just as interesting. It's a bit like life: everything is mixed together, nothing (or almost nothing) is pure.

I am reposting here in blue (for clarity) two things that I liked that you wrote in that discussion.

I wanted to add something afterwards and, between the two, this seems to me the most pertinent discussion.

«Since music is also made of code and syntax, I find it appropriate to speak of language, even if it must be said that it connotes but does not denote; it can have multiple senses but no meaning» (Frank)

«In my opinion, to appreciate something, one does not necessarily need to know its mechanism» (Frank)

I am pleased that you accept 'meaning' when speaking of musical works. And I agree with you on the fact that music «connotes but does not denote; it can have multiple senses but no meaning».

[What a struggle! When talking about music, one always has to open the dictionaries we have in hand to see if the meanings of the terms we use coincide; in other fields, the discussion is easier: at least regarding terminology]

I believe that a characteristic of the most engaging works is having, or allowing themselves to be attributed, more 'senses' or 'meanings'. I have always used these two terms as synonyms; perhaps I was wrong. If you want, tell me something about it (I would like that).

I also agree on the lack of necessity to know the mechanism of something in order to be able to appreciate it. In this sense—in my opinion—those who cannot read music, regarding the possibility of developing a 'friendly relationship' with this or that piece, have nothing to envy those who read the notes on the staff just to "follow better."

Entering (and leaving immediately, unfortunately) the discussion, I respond quickly to ttw.

I was thinking, above all, of opus 111 and the last movement of opus 109. But not only that. Also the Diabelli [Variations].

Forgive me: that little bit of sun coming out (now!) is calling me to the park. I promise myself to write tonight.

a warm greeting to all

Luca

Aside from the list, I would be interested to know how you fit in: "be somewhat the equivalent".

... anyway, I'll wait for this evening ....

The way Beethoven treats the 'variation' in some works from his late creative periods is like the evolution of a conversation between two or more people. Not a conversation that wants to stick 'to the theme' (like those that open in forums), but like those that have always been 'normal' conversations: one moves from one topic to another, without an apparent reason; and often one finds oneself discussing something while wondering—without knowing how to answer—how one arrived there and where one had started. Even in forums, however, our nature comes out: we often go—happily—off-topic, and it is one of the things that moderators, wisely, allow to pass.

If, when a person proposes a theme, one wanted the certainty of not going off (at least not too much), there would be a system: those who respond should do so by reading only 'the theme' and not taking into account, even minimally, any previous responses. Schematically, this would create a 'round dance of opinions': like a wheel whose center is 'the theme' with spokes that, like bridges, connect the center to many 'islands of thought,' each well-defined in itself.

It is in this way, according to this scheme, that I feel, for example, the Variations on Corelli's La Folia that Daniele proposed in the 'Variations' discussion for a friend. Many other variations belong to this way of composing. To me, those from the Baroque period come to mind above all. The Goldberg Variations could be its most conspicuous emblem: each variation has its own expressive autonomy; to the point that if I wanted to play only some of them (privately, not in concert), it would not constitute a travesty. Performing only the Aria of the theme is already a great satisfaction in itself. It is beautiful to listen to. It is beautiful and, in terms of 'emotional density,' it holds its own against any of the thirty variations that Bach let follow it.

Can the same things be said for the Arietta of opus 111 and for Diabelli's little waltz? The latter is not by Beethoven, certainly. But in any case, apart from Diabelli's theme, neither the Arietta of opus 111 nor the themes of the variations contained in sonatas opus 106 and 109, even though they are as enchanting as the Goldberg Aria, would allow themselves to be so impunely isolated from what follows.

Furthermore, 'what follows,' in each case, takes us far, very far away. Just as in a conversation where one knows where it begins but does not know where it might arrive, the different variations that Beethoven juxtaposes in these cycles do not relate directly to their theme, but each arises from the one that precedes it and 'calls' the one that follows it. How could one think of isolating any of them!?

The concatenation is no longer 'circular'—with the theme at the center—but 'chain-like.' One can also think of a 'journey': with its own directionality, with its own goal, its own destiny. Then this 'destiny' can have many names: it is a destiny of death in the Adagio of opus 106, a sweet return in the Finale of op. 109, a luminous dissolution in op. 111, but this does not matter much (also because one could discuss it at length). What matters is that in any case, this music is a moving towards something.

And in this way that Beethoven adopts to make the music of his late variations 'travel,' there is room for the unexpected, the unpredictable, the 'off-topic'... Just like in a discussion!

Who would have suspected that Diabelli's little waltz would arrive at being transfigured into the Sphinx of the 20th variation? Or even that it would graciously endure Leporello's incursion in the 22nd!

Who would have suspected that from the grace of the Arietta in op. 111 there would emerge—in such a short time!—that whirlwind of the 3rd variation which, like a very steep rock wall, carries us into a dimension where everything is transfigured?

Happy May Day to everyone!

Luca

Hello everyone.

I am not naturally entering into the matter, which has already been prodigiously debated by Luca. (I don't think he said it, but some time ago he rightly undertook the writing of a beautiful book regarding the spiritual itinerary of the Ninth Symphony). Since the Arietta of the sonata in C minor was extracted, I leave you here the link with the sketch of the theme of said sonata. http://www.lvbeethoven-music.it/Beethoven-Mp3/Biamonti/Biamonti741.mp3 , theme cited by Nottebohm, Zweite Beethoveniana, page 471. http://www.lvbeethoven.it/Opere/Beethoven-Midi-Mp3-Biamonti.html

The piano of the Mp3 was sampled by me from the one preserved at the Beethoven Haus, Conrand Graf, Room 8, second floor.

Bye!!!

Sampled from the Beethoven Haus? Sorry, but I don't think I understood. Basically, you created a piano library using the piano from the Beethoven Haus? How did you do it?

Hi Lory!

Of course! Nothing is impossible: a small DAT recorder, a Wav file for every piano key (a couple of GB in total), then everything is transformed into an .nki library importable into Kontakt 4 or 5. Finally, a MIDI is created with a sequencer (I am happy with Sonar x2) and Kontakt is used as an external module.... with the sound loaded. Finally, everything is exported as a wav file transformable into mp3 (or directly into mp3 at medium bitrate for the internet). Conversely, one can play and record from a keyboard with the preloaded sound. Naturally, I prefer the first system, since my interest (momentarily) is that of providing culture and information and not Art. I have many libraries of historical keyboards in .nki format.... Ah! I forgot! You also need a Friend (capital F required) like Luigi to introduce you to the world of BH, and I.... well, I have one!

Beautiful, and how do you create NKI libraries? I would be very interested.

Dear Lory,

Frank is absolutely right! You start talking about one topic, and then it shifts to different levels. In fact, however, it's like when you converse among friends. The company is great, the topics interesting.... They will forgive us this little digression among friends. A tutorial for tackling this rather complex task is here: http://www.matsc.net/kontakt%202-i.html and it is valid for NKI and for NKS. On the other hand, you can trick the program simply by going into the folder containing the Wav format files of another library and replacing the existing files with your own, while respecting the bitrate, sample rate and - obviously - the format. I know that one can also intervene on GIG files, which Kontakt reconverts, but sincerely I have never done it and it goes beyond my limited interest in the subject. If you are interested in the Beethovenian piano sound, however, do not hesitate to ask me: I will send it to you without delay!

With Friendship,

A----------------------------------------------------

Ehm…ehm…. Armando… I really was the one who said it … not Frank… I want the copyright !!!

This discussion also confirmed my idea (not that my idea was anything special).

But then I thought of something else: another image.

If the way of conducting the variations in the late Beethoven resembles a 'chain', with its own direction – precise although unpredictable – or (more beautiful) a journey...

our discussions, on the other hand, are better represented by the image of 'a tree': there is the trunk (the main theme, which evolves), but there are also attached branches, AND these branches take on their own direction, their own life.

(Thank you for your memory of my writing on the Ninth from three years ago!)

But. . . speaking of the Arietta of the 111: it is very interesting to listen to the sketch that you pointed out - - > Precisely to make a comparison with the "finished product": that is, the Arietta as we hear it in the 111.

From this comparison, thoughts come to me about Beethoven's way of composing - - - - > thoughts that had come to me the first time when, years ago, you posted [remote past of 'to post' . . . first and last time I use it] Cecilio De Roda's writing on the sketchbook of the canzona of thanks from opus 132.

But, for now, I will keep these thoughts to myself. Before letting a second branch sprout from the trunk of the discussion, I would wait to see if there is anyone who wants to continue on the "trunk" of "How Beethoven treats variations" . . .

Kuss der ganzen Welt! . . . to everyone!

in particular to TheSimon

Luca

Speaking of the trunk, Luca, it occurred to me that perhaps it would therefore be better to start from the roots, working up to the trunk and arriving, thus, at the branches and the vast and monumental canopy that Beethoven created regarding the Variations, and then finally seeing how this robust plant has borne its fruit. Fruits which, as we shall see, will mature until the last century.

The Variations, as is known, were present throughout much of Beethoven's compositional life - his first work composed at only 11 years old was indeed the “Variations for piano on a march by Dressler WoO 63”.

The first series of a certain quality are the “24 Variations for piano on the theme 'Venni amore' by Righini WoO 65”, dating back to the spring of 1791. Piero Rattalino writes of them: «Righini's Arietta is as schematic and skeletal as necessary to be able to undergo without harm all the disguises to which Beethoven subjected it, and also presents the characteristic of adapting well to one of the possibilities of the piano – the opposition of staccato sound and sustained sound – which was closest to the young Beethoven's heart. From both the melodic and harmonic schematicism of the theme arises a work of bustling fantasy, which has the flavor of improvisation born at the keyboard and does not express a true concern for formal organization.»

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pJu4CTxqQU

A very significant anecdote is linked to these variations. In the autumn of 1791, Maximilian Franz, in his capacity as Grand Master of the Knights of the Order, participated in a meeting of that association in Mergenthein. Following the prince were also musicians from the court chapel and Beethoven was among them. They paid a courtesy visit to the Kapellmeister of the Prince-Elector of Mainz, Franz Xaver Sterkel who, on that occasion, met the young composer from Bonn. This made him very happy and, to honor them, he performed one of his Sonatas with violin accompaniment with great grace. It was then Beethoven's turn to be invited by Sterkel to perform the “Variations on the theme of Righini”, variations which he considered too difficult to play but, the Kapellmeister, could not find the score and asked Beethoven if he could do it from memory. The impression his request made on those present was one of a certain incredulity on his part regarding Beethoven's own ability to perform them. This attitude was caught by the young man from Bonn who, accepting the challenge, sat at the piano and performed the Variations with the same grace that Sterkel had previously used in his performance. This was to make him understand that his Variations were, for him, as easy to perform as the Kapellmeister's Sonata had been for these; and, moreover, not content with this demonstration of skill, he added two further Variations elaborated on that occasion. It goes without saying how great the surprise and appreciation were from both Sterkel and the other attendees.

Very particular and interesting were also the variations that Beethoven elaborated on a theme from the ballet “The Creatures of Prometheus” Opus 43, later poured into a contradanza from the WoO 14 series and which finally ascended to the altars of immortality, becoming the finale of the "Eroica Symphony".

These are the “15 Variations and Fugue for piano” Opus 35, called “Eroica Variations”

It is a remarkable work not only for its musical invention but, above all, for the extraordinary compositional treatment that Beethoven reserved for it. The composer indeed opens with only the bass accompaniment without any melody; from this, the other voices gradually enter in double, triple, and quadruple counterpoint and, only after four episodes, comes the first complete Variation, in which the bass merges with the main theme. The brilliant fantasy in the elaboration of the theme, along with the wit of the rhythms, the vast tonal range, and the sumptuousness of the developments, do the rest.

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We now arrive at Beethoven's late period, where Variations, along with the Fugue, acquired a central place in the construction of his greatest musical monuments. They are indeed present, among others, in the Piano Sonatas Opus 109 and Opus 111, in the Finale of the Ninth, in the Adagio of the Quartet Opus 127, and in the Quartet Opus 131.

But it is naturally with Opus 120 that Beethoven achieved monumentality through the Variation form. They can be compared to a set of Bagatelles that encompass the entire universe and musical fantasy of Beethoven, where the earthly element and the sublime touch at an unequaled level of height; we are facing one of the greatest musical-architectural monuments in all of music history.

Their exceptional extraordinariness lies, above all, in the fact that with them, Beethoven succeeded in transforming a very simple theme into a monument of enormous complexity. From this piece, he knew how to derive his unsuspected infinite availability, transforming it into a concatenation of perfect musical events. Indeed, from the very first variation, the waltz is completely nullified by a brilliant inventiveness and imagination that conveys the entire idea of the composer's enormous greatness.

The principle Beethoven used to compose these Variations is indicated at the beginning of the score. “Altered variations,” meaning Variations whose musical writing is based on the alteration of accidentals: sharp, flat, natural. In this manner, the composer wrote 33 variations of very different characters from one another, all of extremely high value.

In extreme synthesis, some comments on certain variations:

Variation no. 1 “Alla marcia Maestoso”: even here Beethoven proves his combinatory ability by separating harmony from melody, developing the latter according to a progression different from the former: fourth intervals for the harmony and second intervals for the melody.

Variation no. 3 “Poco allegro”: A true Ländler in which the original waltz tempo becomes an extremely romantic and popular motif.

Variation no. 5 and 21 “Allegro vivace”: “scherzi” in the most perfect Beethovenian style; the first is characterized by its harmonic coloring, the second contains long wandering pauses in adagio. It should be added that Variation no. 21, along with 6 and 26, represents those closest to the Bachian style due to their geometricity and purity.

As Luca has already mentioned, the 22nd is fun with its quotation from Mozart's “Don Giovanni,” where the aria sung by Leporello at the very beginning, “Notte e giorno faticar,” is recalled.

But the most beautiful and dazzling are the last ones: the 31st, which recalls the lyrical greatness of the Hammerklavier; the 32nd, a brilliant fugue; the 33rd, represented by a very delicate minuet, a worthy and serene conclusion to a journey that, starting from an insignificant motif, reaches an extremely high and impassable peak.

Regarding these Variations, one of the most authoritative things was said by the American pianist-musicologist Charles Rosen: «A work like the Diabelli is above all a discovery of the simplest musical elements, an invention on the language of classical tonality with all its implications of rhythm, as well as melody and harmony. He discovered a universe, a language as rich in possibilities as that which Haydn and Mozart had brought to life. Its uniqueness finds no parallel in the history of music.»

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wctoxElV8Os

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVJ83WKmd9M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IV70oWLVhw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5RN9a7d-Rk

We have thus arrived at the vast, sumptuous, monumental canopy of the tree that Beethoven formed in 45 years of compositional career. What, then, had specifically happened with Beethoven regarding variations, in his miraculous “third style” and, above all, what caused all this to project itself, as “a memory to the future,” to use the words of Italo Calvino and Luciano Berio in their “Un re in ascolto,” bearing its fruit until the last century?

the memory guards the silence

memory of the future the promise

what promise? This that now arrives

to graze with the hem of the voice

and escapes you as the wind caresses

the darkness of the voice the memory

in half-light a memory to the future

The composer Salvatore Sciarrino, in his book “Le figure della musica da Beethoven ad oggi” (Ricordi publisher), has grouped 6 lessons held in some Italian cities from 1992 to 1995, in which he sought to identify «the genealogy» of some musical forms of the contemporary era.

With Beethoven, there was the transition from ostentatious modularity to hidden modularity, and therefore from variation made of several pieces to variation in a single movement:"

«(...) In the Beethovenian era, every movement extends in duration and grows in scale; along with the labor, the unitary conception of the work is strengthened. (...) Beethoven applied himself obstinately to the art of variation. It is for no reason that logic is the strength of his music. To exercise logic means to possess analytical as well as constructive sensitivity.

Beethoven is certainly the first to glimpse even the limit of the variation form: namely, the repetitiveness of the structural scanning. With his usual inventive and non-conformist generosity, he leaves a mark on the history of form and in the soul of the listener. Let us welcome the scandal of this solitary message. (...) In his late works, Beethoven several times bent the modular rigidity of variations to his individual freedom. Those of Opus 131 maintain the classical structure and, at the same time, transcend it.

First of all, the variety of articulations employed and the degree of characterization of each variation are exceptionally high. To some it may seem a contradiction, yet Beethoven achieved this great variety starting from a truly capillary economy of means. He shows organic imaginary capacity, opening up a way, something more and different than simple combinatory ability.

Furthermore, the composer succeeds in passing from one variation to another without us noticing. We levitate in a continuity that enchants.

The overall result resembles no music I know. Deceptive upon listening, it is not easy to understand in what form a piece woven so tightly is written; the score itself would help us little if the usual criteria of analysis were not integrated with holistic criteria. (...) The composer abolishes textual refrains (conventional up to that era) and writes out repetitions extensively, giving space to unusual variants. (...) before the theme is finished, the need to vary has taken over: the varied repetition streamlines the entire musical trajectory.

Even internally within the following pieces, the division into periods is not marked. In fact, between one period and another there is no break in continuity; the music tends toward an uninterrupted flow made of contractions and expansions, thickenings and rarefactions (...)»

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGhsZwPLllc

But the most astounding thing, I continue to think, remains the “Great Fugue Opus 133,” where the Fugue joins the variations, forming a symbiosis of unreachable genius: «the most astounding piece in all musical literature», as Glenn Gould said.

And for those who want and have not heard it, I recommend in this regard, this one which, among other things, can also be downloaded:

http://www.radio3.rai.it/dl/radio3/programmi/PublishingBlock-4e02a2ec-4046-486f-b7b2-54b8a5ab86ab-podcast.html

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http://www.radio3.rai.it/dl/radio3/programmi/PublishingBlock-4e02a2ec-4046-486f-b7b2-54b8a5ab86ab-podcast.html

LucaCavaliere wrote:

I believe that a characteristic of the most engaging works is to have, or allow themselves to be attributed with, more 'senses' or 'meanings'. I have always used these two terms as synonyms; perhaps I was wrong.

It depends. In linguistics, the two terms are distinct and their most common usage dates back to a writing by Frege. In short, "sense" (Sinn) is the way in which a "meaning" (Bedeutung) is expressed, which is always an external reference (the Anglo-Saxons translate Bedeutung as "reference") and is distinguished from representation, which is instead internal and subjective. Note that, as far as I know, in common language Bedeutung is also translated as "sense," so the fact that you consider them synonyms is not strange. Speaking like Frege, however, one could perhaps say that music has many senses and many representations, although I do not know if he ever spoke about music. It remains to be seen whether it is truly possible to have a representation without references, whether direct or indirect.

Bianca.

Johannes Brahms, what an enchanting composer. How I love Brahms!

I think of his catalogue and I think how right Carlos was when he said that on a desert island, he would take all of it with him. In his catalogue, there is very little to discard: Himalayan masterpieces, some Alpine ones, and very few Apennine ones. It is true that he—like Edgar Varèse—destroyed his early works because they were deemed unworthy, but this does nothing to diminish his immense greatness.

Let us start with those I consider a bit more colossal: the Opus 24, the “25 Variations on a Theme by Handel” conceived in September 1861.

In general, for Brahms, his achievement in this genre consists of the perfect balance between the classical rigor of his structure and an absolutely romantic inspiration, rich in melodies and expressive solutions. In this case, it is an aria by Handel extracted from his “Suite No. 1 from Leçons pour le clavecin,” which someone compares—from my point of view, too severely—to the “Diabelli Variations.” Starting from the Beethovenian lesson, Brahms takes this theme and creates a miracle of style, technique, and invention, while strictly observing the harmonic, rhythmic, and melodic traits of the inspiring theme.

These are 25 musical tiles, complete and defined in their autonomy; and if the piano is not treated with gratuitous virtuosity, they reach points of extreme difficulty. One can say, quite rightly, that with them Brahms placed a milestone in the history of varied form, placing himself in the footsteps of Bach's “Goldberg Variations” and Beethoven's “Diabelli Variations.”

I now move on to the wonderful “Variations for Piano on an Original Theme Opus 21 No. 1,” dating from the summer of 1856, a period in the life when the Hamburg genius studied the counterpoint of the ancients and, naturally, Bach in particular. How can one not notice here, too, the fusion of his romantic subjectivity with the stylistic rigor of the ancient masters? But how can one not also notice that the technique, which causes a kind of pulverization of the theme, is also linked to Beethoven's amplifying variation. The differences compared to the “giant” lie in the writing processes, the conduct, and the invention. Consider that when Clara Schumann performed them in Leipzig, she stated that the composer had found himself in a «Bach-Beethoven-Brahms» condition. My friends, this is truly a great piano masterpiece.

But how can one conclude this small invasion of Brahmsian territory without speaking of the “28 Variations on a Theme by Paganini Opus 35” from 1862/63, another cornerstone of the Hamburg genius's piano repertoire, a true counterpart to those on the theme of Handel: two themes at antipodes, two opposite worlds, two different purposes but with a single personal language in tackling the two tasks.

Divided into two books, even in these, the union of the three great German Bs reappears and, in particular, the thought of Beethoven goes to the two finales of the two cycles.

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Speaking of sense and meaning, perhaps this can help

http://www.treccani....io/significato/

http://www.treccani....clopedia/senso/

But I am certain it is said that music has no meaning insofar as it is not a semantic language... therefore any sound object can have sense but not a meaning.

A melody can have many senses... but it means nothing. How can we say that the famous incipit of Beethoven's fifth is someone or something knocking on a door? It is not so... however, we can find this sense in it, like others...

Alright Xenakis…

…fully agree with you regarding the discussion on sense/meaning.

Just to throw in another example, even the incipit of the second movement of the Ninth can remind one of knocks at a door

(by the way: today the Ninth turns 189 years old. Happy Birthday!).

However… regarding Beethoven's way (late Beethoven) of treating variations, which I compared to the evolution of a free discussion, I would appreciate your comment.

You had written that you would be interested in knowing how I ‘tuck in’ that «it is somewhat the equivalent».

Xenakis wrote:

A melody can have many meanings... but it means nothing. How can we say that Beethoven's famous fifth symphony incipit is someone or something knocking at a door? It isn't so... yet we can find this meaning, like others...

Perhaps, strictly speaking in terms of terminology, one should say that a melody (and the rest that follows) is "one" of the senses from which many representations can arise (for example, the mental image of someone knocking at the door). But it is enough just to agree on the terms

Dear Daniele,

given your proposal to start from the 'root' (the youthful variations, which I had never listened to)... I tell you, we are leaving “a lot to the imagination” just like much of the music of their era.

It might seem strange but I am ‘more taken’ by those of the eleven-year-old boy than those of the twenty-two-year-old youth.

I couldn't easily say why... perhaps I am influenced by the fact of knowing it is his first work and... a look at the key.

Eleven years old and... C minor!

(who knows if "Mr. C minor" imagined where that boy would lead him)

(after the Musical Diary posted yesterday by Daniele)

(to Masters Gustav Leonhardt and András Schiff)

Like sheep in a pasture

– beautiful –

the
Goldberg
,

each in her own way, on the meadow of Leipzig.

The quiet one,

the lively one,

the one with slightly dark fur.

At the end of the day

the shepherd gathers them back,

whistling the Aria

calling them all.

But in vain Diabelli

– good man –

would shout his invitation.

"Please, maidens: another round of waltzes!"

They are all mad

you have fled far away,

seduced by a man

who wandered through the fields.

And out of thirty-three

nobody remembers the waltz.

Luca Cavaliere