small debate on the chorale

It means that you start with the 7th in the bass descending by a semitone.

In fact, I agree with AleGozzo: too modern as a solution for a classical chorale.

The 7th should be taken by step (whole tone), and starting like this abruptly seems too much to me as well.

It is feasible for me. It is a solution that can also be found in Bach (Aus tiefer Noth, Herzlich thut mich verlangen)

Zedef wrote:

It is feasible for me. It is a solution that can also be found in Bach (Aus tiefer Noth, Herzlich thut mich verlangen)

lì l'avevo visto pure io

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ScalaQuaranta wrote:

if in your chorale, that specific dominant 7th chord in the 3rd reversal has its effectiveness only if inserted at the beginning of the piece (and naturally and above all, justified by what will happen immediately after!), fine.

but if what follows is a simple succession of chords lacking any particularity, then it doesn't make much sense to use it at the beginning. not because it is an error.... rather see it as having fired a silver bullet into thin air, just to see if the rifle works. it's a shame...

se I had managed to explain it to you in such a clear way, perhaps I would have saved you from opening the discussion

(also because I saw the rest of the chorale which is just a simple succession etc"}

Zedef wrote:

It is feasible for me. It is a solution that can also be found in Bach (Aus tiefer Noth, Herzlich thut mich verlangen)

On the other hand, the bass of the initial chord of the Chorale (D-G#-E-B) comes from the harmony of the previous Trio, in D minor. I think it is sufficient to explain a dissonance that is, in a certain sense, "prepared". Besides, it is not even the most astonishing point of the Cantata!

I don't remember other similar passages in Bach... if you are aware of any, let me know!

I agree with Red, a chord should never be evaluated in isolation...

If we start from the assumption that the choir singing will be poor, obviously a triad in root position is better.

If the third inversion is too daring, one can start on the dominant in root position and provide the passing seventh.

For me, every harmonic solution works, provided that the grammar and syntax are correct. Then other parameters come into play (historical-stylistic context, taste, level of difficulty...).