Piano technology

Strange things about a new piano

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GikoGomez

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Opening post by GikoGomez

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Hi everyone

I bought a Kawai GL-10 2 months ago in a "trial version," meaning that if no one in the apartment building "complains," I will later upgrade to a C1X or C2x.

The initial idea was the CX, but the dealer advised me against spending too much money only to discover that I play it silently 90% of the time.

Instead, surprisingly, I almost never use the silent mode.

Anyway, let's get to the little problems, which I would like to fully resolve so I can enjoy the piano while I have it.

When I play, and barely touch the sustain pedal, or press it down just a tiny bit, I feel the keys "hitting" the pedal.

I have always had an upright, but I have also played around on various grands; I don't remember hearing anything similar.

Then, aside from the usual keys that stick, typical of many new pianos, there is the highest A on a single string (I believe A3) that goes "sboing."

Due to COVID, I couldn't wait for the technician and had it tuned myself (as I had done for 35 years on my upright), but it can't be that, since being a single string, you can't even blame two or three strings vibrating differently.

The technician will be coming soon, but I would like to know precisely what to ask him.

If anyone could enlighten me, thanks!

PS: I cannot stand that pressing the left pedal causes the keyboard to shift; it's just unacceptable!!! But this isn't the piano's fault, even though implementing the upright system would have made more sense... but while playing a Chopin, seeing the keys move.... I prefer to concentrate and play PPP on my own.

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Reply 2 by pianoexpert

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That the keyboard shifts is normal and one gets used to it. As for the pedal problem, I don't quite understand. Some incorrect adjustment. If the keys that remain "pressed" depend on the keyboard (the front and/or center gasket is tight relative to the sliding on the pin) or from some pin of the action that is "lazy," meaning it doesn't have the right friction. This can happen in new pianos if they have been in humid areas (warehouse) or stationary for a long time before being sold and played. The technician will investigate. The only important suggestion: NEVER USE DRY OR GREASY LUBRICANTS on the gaskets and pins; instead, if necessary, replace the defective pins (I am referring to those of the action and not those of the keyboard), boring out the gasketed holes with STRAIGHT REAMERS AND NOT CONICAL ONES. The replaced pin must be larger in diameter.

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Reply 3 by GikoGomez

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Thank you

in practice, when I play, if I touch or barely press the pedal, I feel the hammer strikes through my foot, as if something in the pedal-keyboard connection were not perfectly tight.

I no longer feel this if I press completely, but only at the beginning of the stroke, up to a quarter of the pedal; it seems to disappear once I'm halfway through.

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Reply 4 by pianoexpert

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It seems to me that it is a practice pedal (silent). If so, it could be the hammers hitting the silent rail which is adjusted too far back in its resting position. Otherwise, from this distance, it is difficult to evaluate. Even with the silent, just like with a mute, neighbors are equally disturbed because a mute does not attenuate much, and with the silent or a digital piano, a series of keyboard strikes are transmitted which are amplified by the structure (instrument and floor).

I lean much more towards the digital as a solution that can serve to read the piece and "get it down" before playing it at an advanced stage on the acoustic instrument.

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Reply 5 by GikoGomez

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Yes, now that you mention it, I really think so, thank you!!!! In fact, some keys make more noise than others when the silent mode is deactivated, so I believe it is indeed the silent bar.

In effect, my Roland FA08 is much quieter, I don't disturb the neighbors, so much so that soon I will switch to a GX or a CX without silent mode, but my sheep (wife) watches TV in the same room and asks me to use the Roland.

Now that I remember, the few times I used the silent mode, when I was restoring the acoustic sound, I had to fiddle with the bar back and forth because when I put it "at rest" for the first time, the noise of the silent mechanism could be heard, even though the acoustic sound was playing; so I think it just needs to be adjusted better, and in general, to avoid using silent mode on a grand piano, although it seems to me that Yamaha is much better.

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Reply 6 by GikoGomez

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Thanking you for the answers, I would like to take the opportunity to also ask you about the BOING sound produced by the highest 3 single-string keys.

They are: A1, Bb1, B1.

It is clear that the depth of the bass is not that of a 180 cm piano, and that the bass sounds thin I had already anticipated, but that those three silly ones go BOING as soon as they are pressed, no. Then the sound normalizes, but it starts with a BOING.

The technician will be coming shortly, but in any case, what could it be?

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Reply 7 by pianoexpert

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If the strings result in being dead, you can try turning them. The technician knows how. If they don't know, they will make up a story to tell you it can't be done. But I hope that won't be your case. By turning them there is no risk, especially if they are new. Otherwise, they must be replaced. Also check their adherence to the bridge.

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Reply 8 by GikoGomez

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Thanks again, when it comes we will hear what it says. More than deaf, a metallic BOING at the beginning of the sound. As if, for example, at the maximum extent of the vibration, it touched a metal body.

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Reply 9 by pianoexpert

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If the sound is metallic, it may depend on the copper windings. Check the terminals and bring them closer together, tightening them with pliers.

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Reply 11 by pianoexpert

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No. Out of respect, let the technician resolve things as he sees fit. Then, there can be an interesting exchange of opinions between you. After all, from a distance, one can only make hypotheses. Instead, let me know how the problem was resolved.

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Reply 12 by GikoGomez

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In fact, you are right. For the same reason, I imagine they will notice that I have tuned it myself... but I am not worried.

Now I will try to have the piano prepared as best as possible; then, once I have its sound clearly in my ears, I will try the CX and GX models and see if upgrading to a superior model is worth it.

It is clear, however, that sound is not the only deciding factor.... there is an entire world inside there, and you know that very well.

Thank you

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Reply 13 by GikoGomez

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Hi! Finally the Kawai technician came by; he partially fixed a problem with the silent bar, then he fixed 3 out of four "Sboings," pricked the hammer with a pencil that ended in a point (what is it called?) and removed it on three notes; one remains, but he said that after 6 months from the purchase, he must return to extract the action and perform a thorough inspection.

What do you think?

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Reply 14 by pianoexpert

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Well... before tuning (perhaps with a three-needle tuner..) and covering the defect, it is advisable to check the winding of the string and also the damper rail. The latter might be grazed when the string creates its "belly". Then tune...(but not too much for double basses!!)

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Reply 15 by GikoGomez

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I imagined, thanks, I hope that when he returns to regulate the mechanics he does it differently, otherwise I will ask him.

Or maybe I'll let it go since the project would be to move to a superior model at the end of the year, let's see

Tante grazie Paolo

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Reply 16 by GikoGomez

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I'll take advantage of this 3D thread again to say that I tried, side by side, the three new CXs and... surprise: contrary to what logic would dictate, from the 1 to the 3 the bass was "lightening"; the 1 had a very present and full bass, the opposite of my GL-10, but as the size increased it "cleaned up" and sounded... less bassy, thus finding that typical Yamaha sound.

Furthermore, even though there is the same gap in cm between one model and the next, it seems to me 161, 166, 184, the first two were similar while the C3x was quite different.

A part from this, which beyond the prestige of the model comes down to personal taste, one thing I noticed compared to mine is that the 3 models had a clean sustain, whereas when I press the pedal on mine I feel a lot of confusion, sounds wandering around, mixing together; in short, it's not a nice sustain. Materials too cheap?

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Reply 17 by pianoexpert

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One must know how to regulate the pedal and the release of the dampers. Even the tuning and the voicing of the hammers contribute to the "compactness" of the sound

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