Guide to buying a new/used piano

The Great Return...

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Started by

Francesco

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Opening post by Francesco

Posts
251
City
Torino

Hello everyone!

It is with pleasure that I announce my return to piano study, picking up from the sixth year. Or rather, it is with great pleasure that I announce that I have re-enrolled in piano. To be admitted to the Scuola Civica Musicale di Torino, I will have to undergo an interview with the Piano teacher and present a piece of my choice. I believe that, as you might imagine, I will play "Moonlight Sonata"... but that is not why I am writing.

I think it is now time to "step up a notch" regarding my keyboard, which is now functioning just over half the time.

In short, I think it's time to purchase a nice Piano. I don't know yet if I should go for digital or acoustic...

What can you tell me about Yamaha studio pianos in general? A nice model, but without going overboard... unfortunately the crisis is hitting everyone ๐Ÿ™‚ !

In particular, I tried a Yamaha C110A, I think... do you know it? It generally made a good impression on me... perhaps the one I played was a bit out of tune and the action wasn't well regulated... and I don't really like the low notes... too stiff and metallic... but one gets used to everything just to have a real piano ๐Ÿ˜‰ .

What do you recommend (not necessarily Yamaha)? Clearly, I would like a Schimmel even more, but... the price goes up a bit! ๐Ÿ˜‰

I await your answers and advice... for now, I'm going back to playing on my dear six-octave little keyboard... ๐Ÿ˜‰๐Ÿ˜† Bye!

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Reply 2 by camy86

Posts
148
City
San Giorgio al Tagliamento (VE)

I have a Yamaha U3S, I would recommend this one: I am happy with it. Present bass, balanced treble, light and fast action. Perhaps if you find a good used one, you could find the compromise between price and performance. Warning: it is a piano that plays "loud". Let me explain: it is 130cm and therefore the soundboard does its job, but if you have problems with neighbors I recommend a digital one with a midi-usb interface and a piano VST of your choice: you can study whenever you want!

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Reply 3 by Thesimon

Posts
4,504
City
Ariccia, RM

Ooooo good, good! Actually, very good, finally we are getting serious.

Digital or acoustic piano?? The eternal dilemma... It depends.

The first painful "note", just to stay on theme, is certainly the neighbors. Knowing acoustic and digital pianos well, I would feel inclined to direct you toward an acoustic one. Why this advice? Because your first piano, the one on which you must train your ear, must be an acoustic piano, in addition to the feeling you must establish with the instrument. I am of the opinion that a pianist can be a pianist without ever having owned a digital one, but not vice versa. However, as I was saying, you always have to deal with the neighbors, especially if you live in an apartment building. In any case, respecting the hours (9:00 - 12:00 and 16:00 - 20:00), barring excessive noise, no one can say anything to you. With a digital, perhaps you could even play later, taking for example a digital piano costing around 400/500 euros, which is not much at all. It is also true that with digital you can do many beautiful things that you can also do with an acoustic, but they require a lot of study, a lot of experience, and a lot of money; I am talking about recordings. Recording with digital is child's play; recording with an acoustic is a very difficult task, especially for an instrument like the piano. First of all, it requires very expensive equipment: at least 2 good condenser microphones with a very high dynamic range (at least 300 euros per microphone), a good preamplifier, preferably valve-based (we are around 1500 euros), and finally a good audio interface (here we start from 500 up to even 4000 euros). Moreover, there is another problem: knowledge of acoustics... Where to place the microphones? Which stereo miking technique to use? How to compensate for the room? What is the right angle for the capsules so that the sound isn't piercing in the recording? How to adjust the equalizer?

Finally, there is the need to use music production software (which also costs money and which you must be able to use: during the recording phase and the mastering phase). In short, as you will have understood, recording a piano is a very difficult and very expensive thing...

With digital, you only need music production software, a computer that you already own, a USB MIDI interface that costs around 30 euros, a sample library of your liking, and very few skills.

However, playing on a digital is not like playing on an acoustic!! Setting the mechanics aside, which in itself justifies the purchase of an acoustic over a digital, there is a problem with the sound. The samples are beautiful, but they are still recordings of a concert grand piano, and it's not like playing on the concert grand itself... Let me explain better. By playing samples, you obtain a recorded performance; you do not obtain a live performance in which you are enveloped by the sound! This is a very important thing. Analog in music is anyway, by definition, superior to digital. (Assuming equal instruments: Steinway D vs. a Steinway D library).

If, however, you live in an apartment with "down-to-earth" neighborsโ€”not to use terms that might cast me in a bad lightโ€”it is obvious that you will have to opt for a good digital; otherwise, go for the acoustic. I am sure that Paolo can recommend a good acoustic piano at a low price. I seem to remember an offer he made in a second-hand market for a practically new piano. Get information from him...

Ciao!

PS. How much time do you have to prepare before the entrance exam? It would be a good idea to stay in close contact, perhaps via videoconference, if you want and find it useful, together with Paolo to hear the piece you want to present. Consider that Beethoven's "Moonlight" Adagio is not an easy piece at all. It is easy to read but very difficult regarding touch and tempo. I am sure Paolo will agree with me on this last statement.

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Reply 4 by pianoexpert

Posts
3,876
City
rocca di papa

Dear Francesco,

What wonderful news!!!!!! You will be a pianist. I can already see you on the cover of the Beethoven complete sonatas (naturally, in the booklet of the collection, you will talk about how you started playing the Moonlight Adagio!!!!!! ๐Ÿ˜† )

Good. Now we need to talk about pianos. We need to understand your budget. In any case, don't just look at new ones. If you found a great brand to restore in your area, that might even be beautiful! You are a special person and I don't think you need a piano just for studying. You are someone who, like I was as a boy, appreciates the sound and the instrument for what it is, and loves owning it. Now, for studying, Simone told you correctly, a good digital for 1500 euros is enough. I also study well on the Roland FP7. If I were you, I would look, I would look. Then we will see how to see it. Look even far from you. And close to you. You have to feel it is yours. Who knows if you won't discover an old Bechstein or Steinway and others that make you fall in love? Do not rule out any possibility. Older pianos are not worth much on the market, but it depends on how they are reconditioned and restored. The important thing is to check the state of the soundboard, the bridges, and the integrity of the frame. Then everything remains to be seen. Today, perfectly reproduced identical materials can be obtained. One can restore, with love and expertise, the true identity to an old Bechstein and make it sound and function at nearly 90%, perhaps even more.

Regarding new uprights, Schimmel and Seiler are at the top (obviously leaving aside Bluthner, Bechstein, and Steinway, which are very expensive but wonderful). Then some Ibach, and then we move on to the Eastern ones (some very good ones like Atlas or Apollo...) Yamaha S series and Kawai (some).

Grand pianos... A good Seiler 180. Yamaha from C3 onwards. Also the Rosenbach that our member is selling for 6,000 is an excellent piano. It's a 180 and it's new. Well-tuned, it is very good. It's far away, but you should consider it. It's like new at half price. Then obviously we approach the big brands. For grands, I would exclude Schimmel and Ibach. Maybe find a Schidmeyer. Mason Hamlin is fabulous. We know a friend there, my great friend Bettin, who is taking an interest in these pianos. It's almost like having a Steinway.

In short, happy hunting, friend. Ignore the distances and search over a wide range.

An affectionate greeting to the future Maestro

Paolo

Member

Reply 5 by Francesco

Posts
251
City
Torino

Thanks to everyone...

I will look in the area, and not just to see if there is any good old piano... meanwhile I'll try not to lose sight of the Knauss - Coblenz that I told you about. That's all for now, but I'll let you know as soon as I have any news. Thanks again for what you do and for your availability. Bye!

Ps: C

Dear Francesco,

What wonderful news!!!!!! You will be a pianist. I can already see you on the cover for the complete Beethoven sonatas (naturally in the booklet of the collection, you will talk about how you started playing the Moonlight Adagio!!!!!! )

๐Ÿ˜‰ ;) ๐Ÿ™ If only! And what future maestro? Come on... ๐Ÿ™‚๐Ÿ˜†๐Ÿ˜‰

Member

Reply 6 by Francesco

Posts
251
City
Torino

HERE I AM AGAIN!!!!

First of all, I apologize for my prolonged absence over these last few days: I had access to a computer very few times.

In compensation, I now bring you two GREAT NEWS:

1- Audition for the Piano course at the Scuola Civica Musicale di Torino: ADMITTED!!!! ๐Ÿ˜†๐Ÿ™‚

2- Request to use the Bechstein Grand Piano two hours a week: SUCCESSFUL!!!! ๐Ÿ˜‰๐Ÿ˜‰

To recap, not only am I RETURNING TO THE PIANO, but I will also be studying on the Bechstein! What more could I ask for? ๐Ÿ˜‰

Ciaooo!

Member

Reply 8 by Francesco

Posts
251
City
Torino

Ouch... I spoke too quickly... Still nothing regarding the Bechstein due to restoration... At least when I finally can, it will be FINISHED, complete, and I hope well-restored...

In any case, I confirm: piano lessons twice a week at the Scuola Civica Musicale Torino.

I will keep you updated... Bye!

Member

Reply 9 by Francesco

Posts
251
City
Torino

Ps maybe I'm bringing a new member to the Pianoconcerto family... She is self-taught, she started studying around June, I met her through a flautist friend of mine... Soon...

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