Harmony and counterpoint

The Harmonic Step

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Aspirante

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Opening post by Aspirante

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Isernia

Hi, I'm writing to bother you with a question.

Considering strong and weak beats in a measure, are there preferential chords that should be placed on the beat or on the "off-beat" (levare)...?

I mean, does it always go on the beat? For example, VII on the beat and V on the off-beat, then moving to I or I6... I hope that's clear

Thanks

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Reply 3 by Ludovica

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In my opinion, there is a bit of confusion in the question in relation to the topic title, or rather, in a broad sense, the harmonic progression can also be given by the succession of cadences... which can be of different types and of different intensities.

As for the rest of the question, it depends on the effect one wants to achieve and, historically speaking, when that effect was more or less used. Therefore, there is also a relationship in terms of stylistic aspect.

So perhaps a contextualization of the question is also needed.

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Reply 4 by ScalaQuaranta

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torino

there are no structural constraints....if anything, if we must speak of constraints, there could be particular choices related to the intended style. in a 'scholastic' context (classical harmony) there are certain cadential formulas that on the downbeat necessarily require a certain harmony which then resolves into another on the upbeat. e.g.:

4th and 6th chord on the V degree (e.g., of C major - i.e., G [bass] - C - E) on the DOWNBEAT which resolves into the subsequent 3rd and 5th chord on the same bass (i.e., G [bass] - B - D) on the UPBEAT.

another example of 'constrained harmony' manifests with the use of notes foreign to the harmony (e.g., suspensions but above all, in this case, appoggiaturas). suspensions and appoggiaturas have their 'percussion' phase on the downbeat and their 'resolution' phase, normally on the upbeat or in the subsequent movement.

the previous example (4th and 6th chord), beyond the cadential formula, could also be considered as a dominant harmony where the B is appoggiated by the C and the D is appoggiated by the E.

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Reply 6 by Aspirante

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Isernia

Thank you for the first interventions, Ludovica, I am indeed a bit confused ...otherwise I wouldn't have asked

ScalaQuaranta wrote:

speaking always of classical harmony, I forgot to mention HARMONIC SYNCOPATION which is usually not used in a school setting.

Do you mean that it is in the repertoire? Can you perhaps point me to some composer examples?

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Reply 7 by thallo

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Aspirante wrote:

Thanks for the first interventions, Ludovica, I am actually a bit confused ...otherwise I wouldn't have asked

Do you mean that they are in the repertoire, yes? Can you perhaps point out some examples from established authors?

I don't have examples of harmonic syncopation at hand, but practically all the rules of classical harmony are "abstractions" that do not exist in the repertoire

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Reply 8 by Oracolo

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Aside from pre-Romantic Beethoven, who is no longer classical, I cannot think of any examples ... so I join the request: tangible examples of harmonic syncopation in Classicism?

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Reply 9 by Oracolo

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thallo wrote:

...practically all the rules of classical harmony are non-existent "abstractions" in the repertoire

It sounds a bit bad and a bit strange as a thing, Piston pedantically cites only authoritative examples ... this leaves me excluding the self-referentiality of the "rules"... at least a priori.

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Reply 10 by thallo

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look, harmonic syncopation is even a bizarre concept outside of four-part polyphony... if we consider it as the continuation of the same harmony across the bar line, we can make a tide of situations fit within it

http://conquest.imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/9/97/IMSLP82506-PMLP01830-Mozart-KV279ama.pdf

since I didn't know where to look, I took Mozart's first piano sonata, and between the fifth and sixth bars, on the weak beats, there is always dominant harmony... if you then look for the legato bass of the little exercises, it's difficult to find examples of anything there :-) bass harmonization exercises are not a repertoire

http://conquest.imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/9/97/IMSLP82506-PMLP01830-Mozart-KV279ama.pdf

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Reply 11 by Oracolo

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Who knows why at school they break our balls... with harmonic syncopation...?...

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Reply 12 by thallo

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because, as I was saying before, these are abstractions for educational purposes. It is not art music. Free composition does not follow rules of this type

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Reply 13 by Tap

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48
thallo wrote:

all the rules of classical harmony are non-existent "abstractions" in the repertoire

...bingo!

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