When ...large Orchestra?

... as a starting point

Some examples of a "large orchestra" taken from the repertoire:

Bartók, Concerto for Orchestra: woodwinds 3333, brass 4331, timpani, percussion, 2 harps, strings

Debussy, La Mer: woodwinds 3324, brass 4531, timpani, percussion, 2 harps, glockenspiel, strings

Shostakovich, Symphony No. 5: woodwinds 3233, brass 4231, timpani, percussion, 2 harps, piano, celesta, strings

Strauss, Also sprach Zarathustra: woodwinds 4444, brass 6432, timpani, percussion, organ, strings

Some examples of a symphony orchestra of normal proportions:

Beethoven, Symphony No. 5: woodwinds 3223, brass 223, timpani, strings

Brahms, Symphony No. 1: woodwinds 2223, brass 423, timpani, strings

Mendelssohn, Symphony No. 4 "Italian": woodwinds 2222, brass 22, timpani, strings

I hope this helps you get an idea.

Thank you very much to both of you, now I will also try to look for the scores.

However, I have a quick question: is there a preferred way to write, for example, the 3 flutes, I mean. Do they need 1, 2, or 3 staves?

Of course, managing all these staves... you need at least an A3

For the conductor, what is better: is A3 a preferred format or is an A4 (mega-shrunk?) still preferred?

Destroyed wrote:

Thank you very much to both of you, now I will also try to look for the scores.

However, I have a quick question: is there a preferred way to write, for example, the 3 flutes, I mean. Do they need 1, 2, or 3 staves?

It might depend on whether there is a soloist, maybe 1+2. 2 staves seems redundant to me.

AbateFaria wrote:

Of course, managing all these staves... you need at least an A3

For the conductor, what is better, is A3 a preferred format or is an A4 (mega-shrunk?) still preferred?

If it were up to me, A3 is better... I can't see a damn thing

Personally, I have all scores enlarged to A3 or B4 for convenience both during study and while working with the orchestra, but it is a subjective matter. If someone has 11/10 vision up close and far away, maybe they can even use mini pocket versions, but that is not my case.

As for the distribution of woodwinds in threes, generally two staves are used, with 1st and 2nd on the same staff (as is normal) and 3rd on a separate staff, also considering that often the 3rd has the option to change (the 3rd flute is also piccolo, the 3rd oboe is also English horn, and so on, even if it is not mandatory). In case of very complex passages, it may be necessary to switch to three staves, but it is a temporary option (and I don't know how one can manage this with a program like Finale, which I have used little and only for strictly necessary purposes...). In Also sprach Zarathustra, which I mentioned before, at the first ff the score is distributed as follows (each line a staff):

- piccolo

- flutes 1. 2. 3.

- oboes 1. 2. 3.

- E-flat clarinet.

- clarinets 1. 2.

- bassoons 1. 2. 3.

- contrabassoon

- horns 1. 2.

- horns 3. 4.

- horns 5. 6.

- trumpets 1. 2.

- trumpets 3. 4.

- tromb. 1. 2.

- tromb. 3.

- tuba 1. 2.

eccetera eccetera...

-

Carlos wrote:

Personally, I have all my scores enlarged to A3 or B4 for convenience both during practice and while working with the orchestra, but it is a subjective matter. If someone has 20/20 vision up close and far away, maybe they even use mini pocket ones

...how on earth will they manage with iPads

Let's say that in the ensemble I have a piccolo and 3 flutes.

Is it reasonable to dedicate one staff to Piccolo and Flute 1 (with substitution) and another staff to flutes 2,3?

Destroyed wrote:

Let's say that in the ensemble I have a piccolo and 3 flutes.

Is it reasonable to dedicate one staff to Piccolo and Flute 1 (with substitution) and another staff to flutes 2,3?

Does that mean you have 4 instrumentalists? Or that you have 3 and one also plays the Piccolo?

In the case that you have 3 instrumentalists, it is not the 1st who also plays the Piccolo, but the 3rd flute (or the second).

The first NEVER plays the piccolo if there is at least a second flute.

If you have 3 instrumentalists you can use two staves:

- 1. and 2.

- 3. (Piccolo);

if you have 4 instrumentalists you can do it like this:

- Piccolo

- 1. 2. and 3.

Ok, now it's clearer to me. Thank you.

Practically, the lowest paid one even plays 2 instruments

Carlos wrote:

Personally, I have all scores enlarged to A3 or B4 for convenience both during practice and during work

Help me out a second, is B4 double the size of A3?

AbateFaria wrote:

Help me for a second, is B4 the double of A3?

No: B4 is halfway between A4 and A3. The double of A3 is A2.

With Finale (if it helps anyone) it is very simple.

Once the score is completed, you need to be in Page View mode. Click the button that shows two overlapping sheets (in English I have it and it says "Page Layout"). The same wording "Page Layout" will appear on the toolbar; click Optimize Staff System, which will be something like Ottimizzare sistema righi. This is the tool that allows you to delete staves from individual pages in case they do not have music written on them!

Ociredef wrote:

With Finale (if it helps anyone) it is very simple.

Once the score is completed, you must be in Page View mode. Click the button that shows two overlapping sheets (I have it in English and it says "Page Layout"). The same wording "Page Layout" will appear on the toolbar; click Optimize Staff System, which will be something like Ottimizzare sistema righi. This is the tool that allows you to delete staves from individual pages in case they do not have music written on them!

For further details

http://www.finalemusic.com/UserManuals/Finale2010win/Content/Finale/IDD_PL_OPTIMIZATION.htm

Keep in mind that from Finale 2012 the music changes

http://www.finalemusic.com/UserManuals/Finale2012Mac/Content/Finale/G_Optimization.htm