Why 432?

In the middle of the 19th century, there was no uniformity in the tunings of any orchestra or theater, and pitch was only fixed at 435 Hz in 1885 with a congress in Vienna (later, in the middle of the 20th century, at 440 Hz). In Italy, in the main opera houses (Florence, Milan, Naples), the pitch was between 445 and 450 Hz, while during the same period pianos were tuned to 432 (this was the so-called "piano pitch"). This should well explain Verdi's desire to see the pitch standardized at that frequency: singers (soloists and choristers) practiced their parts with the piano at 432 and, as soon as they stepped onto the stage for rehearsals with the orchestra, they found themselves having to sing in a different key. Even today, if a singer, after studying the part with a piano tuned to 440, goes to an orchestra and finds the tuning at 442/443 (now practically standardized), they are in difficulty... imagine how it must have been to study at 432 and have to sing on stage at 445/450! Furthermore (but this is my hypothesis), at that time neither string nor wind instruments were designed for such high tunings, so I imagine the sound suffered greatly, something that, probably, Verdi did not like.

Well, so he did it for a technical necessity and not because 432 is a multiple of 8 (but 440 is too!) the earth's resonance frequency etc. etc....

Sergio wrote:

Well, so he did it for a
technical necessity and not because 432 is a multiple of 8 (but 440 is too!) the resonance frequency of the earth etc. etc....

.... huh?

thallo wrote:

.... eh?

It was just some irony towards those people who make huge claims about 432.

They even go as far as to claim that instruments tuned to 432 sound better because the air molecules resonate at that frequency! But the question about Verdi was serious.

Sergio wrote:

They even go as far as to claim that instruments tuned to 432 sound better because the air molecules resonate at that frequency!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

The "A" that Verdi liked

http://citymeg.com/blog/2015/06/29/la-piaceva-verdi/

Few know that Giuseppe Verdi fought a personal battle with the Italian government. The great composer requested a law that would restore the use of the natural A in conservatories.

Personally, I like the 432 tuning better. Greater resonance of the instrument, a softer sound even if with a bit less volume. Then listening to Chopin played on a 432 piano versus a 440 one feels like hearing a different piece. Naturally, by lowering the tuning, even if only slightly, between multiple instruments it might be easier to notice out-of-tune notes...

A matter very worthy of further investigation... personally, I am very struck by the fact that one of the least invasive systems for diagnosing a fracture consists of using a tuning fork associated with a stethoscope and, in order for the resonance with the human body to be effective for diagnostic purposes, the tuning fork must produce C 128 Hz (not 130.828 Hz). Therefore, A 432, which seems to involve us more deeply on an emotional level, is also pleasing to our body!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTo6Hv0fp9s

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2681212/

Open content (youtube)

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2681212/

It is not a matter of frequencies: for the same principle, if the soundboard of a piano (or a guitar, violin etc.) is damaged, you don't notice it only with A at 432 Hz, but by playing any note...

I will try to give my opinion. Beyond the fact that each of us can embrace whichever pitch we want and believe in for many technical, spiritual, auditory, etc., reasons... we must understand that our modern instruments, pianos, are built to be tuned to a pitch of 440. Naturally, there is a calculation that takes into account the length of each string as well as its frequency. From this, the diameters and, above all, the tensions are derived, which must have a certain coherence and uniformity with the succession of the courses. The calculation of the entire string bed also takes into account the pressure of the strings on the bridges, and everything also accounts for the impedance of the soundboard. Naturally, the situation is much more complex and these four words cannot be exhaustive in describing what happens. However, one can easily imagine how the "numbers" may change as frequencies different from those assigned by the design change. In reality, it may be true that a piano tuned to 432 Hz might result in being "sweeter," like a voice that wants to softly describe a sad episode lowering itself and modulating away from its true color. In fact, with the variation of the frequency not corresponding to the design frequency, while leaving the diameter and length unchanged, the timbre also varies. The pianist might not find the instrument uniform and satisfying in certain registers. The super high notes and extreme lows will suffer quite a bit, as well as the transition region from the plain strings to the wound strings. Even the attack transient will be different. Perhaps less powerful and striking, which is the pride of major brands that promote the quality of their instrument based on the peculiarity of being clear and incisive in the succession of rapid passages. Even the soundboard should, with a pitch "tending downwards," be calculated and loaded differently. Truly complex. Personally, I prefer to maintain 440 and perhaps act on the hammer voicing; a delicate intervention that can, however, meet the needs of a more or less soft timbre and overall sound.

Splendid thread, thank you

In this regard, Righini writes (I believe as early as the '90s):

Tuning of musical instruments – the "normal" A
Between June 20 and 22, 1970, in Toledo, a working group appointed by the Council of Europe—composed of musicians, musicologists, instrumentalists, physicists, instrument makers, and legal experts, which had already held meetings in Salzburg (1968) and Florence (1969)—definitively closed the century-old question of the "normal A."
This problem, which the French government raised in concrete terms more than 100 years ago, has seen various meetings and congresses (Paris, 1859 - Vienna, 1885 – London, 1939, 1953, 1955) without, however, reaching (except now) an effective solution. Meanwhile, the discomfort caused by the continuous push toward ever higher pitch was particularly lamented, especially by singers, while even the sense of original tonalities was being undermined, to the point that in certain cases one had to wonder if that particular note was an A or a Bb.
The Toledo international convention, drafted with the criterion of maximum respect for the freedom of the artist and musical performance—the disregard of which had determined the ineffectiveness of previous initiatives—strictly establishes that musical instruments must be manufactured so as to give A3 (it is the A on the second space in treble clef) with a frequency of 440 Hz, at an ambient temperature of 20° C. These must also be the conditions for the calibration of reference instruments, tuning forks, electric or mechanical oscillators, etc.
The same frequency, i.e., 440 Hz, is set bindingly for the tuning of musical instruments of any orchestra or instrumental ensemble at the initial moment of rehearsal or performance. The convention also provides for adequate controls.
Since the issue, rather than being one of true musical technique, is one of good manners and artistic education, the convention expressly addresses all Music Schools and Entities, including broadcasting ones, that are in any way interested in music, and therefore also concert societies, not only for the rigorous application of the new rules, but also for their dissemination, within the framework of adequate promotion, which is an authentic prophylaxis of musical hygiene.

It's the adjective "natural" that doesn't sit right with me; in fact, I would say that this presumed "superiority" has no scientific basis, and I say this even though I was born in August and love the number 8.

Kappa wrote:

The “A” that Verdi liked

http://citymeg.com/blog/2015/06/29/la-piaceva-verdi/

Few know that Giuseppe Verdi fought a personal battle with the Italian government. The great composer called for a law that would restore the use of A natural in conservatories.

Regarding A 432, all sorts of things have been said. In the past, when piano frames were not yet made of metal [Note: original says 'wood', likely meaning cast iron vs wood], instruments were tuned to lower reference frequencies, mainly because the string tension would have caused the frame to collapse upon itself. Later, a real controversy arose, also linked to even esoteric references. There are those who have joked about the resonance frequencies of the matter surrounding us, but I assure you it is not difficult to find things of this nature and even worse on the internet. I believe that all technological research has brought improvements in every field. The choice of 440 Hz as a reference is the "natural" (this time used in the strict sense of the term) evolution of this concept in the musical field. Larger concert halls, lesser auditory capacities, and greater ambient noise have required richer sounds and more decisive attacks. I once saw a Kawai documentary on the study and design of a piano, and you cannot imagine how much mathematics and physics are behind it. At these levels, things never happen by chance or by trial and error. As in the best scientific tests, one starts from a hypothesis proven through mathematical theories to then arrive at its empirical demonstration. I believe that with today's technologies, design engineers would have understood whether it was worth returning to the 432 Hz reference...

I found another gem

http://www.scienzaeconoscenza.it/articolo_for_print.php?id=24166