Some time ago, I analyzed the fourth movement of Brahms' Symphony No. 4.
At that time, I conducted an experiment which, however, I did not complete due to a lack of time.
I did a Variations exercise that was very close to the variations presented by Brahms.
Responding therefore to those who said that the variations were 'diesel', perhaps they will realize that this criticism also narrowly touches upon the 4th movement of the aforementioned symphony. I learned from frank how to set traps along the paths, and let's just say that someone fell for it
Well, it's clear there is no desire to debate... Thanks anyway for the albeit brief comments
T
Talentuoso
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Reply 74 by Talentuoso
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raffaeleb wrote:
Well, it's clear there is no desire to debate... Thanks anyway for the albeit brief comments
Evidently you only provided the correct information 7 hours ago... it's not like one lives on the forum... it's not a job... ok?
What does desire have to do with it? Having clarified this....
I just downloaded it... what is the point? And who fell into a trap regarding what?
Some preliminary considerations:
- a guitar cannot compensate for the timbral nuances of an orchestra... even accounting for the strings...
- the counter-proof of the uselessness of reading the score
- The already orchestrated intro is insufficient "on its own" to maintain that all those "guitar-like" arpeggios are equally orchestratable (it is also true that we heard what Jean Françaix does with Chopin)
...could you please say clearly what you are alluding to or what eventually "annoyed" you about the comments you received on the piece ... to bring Brahms into it?
You surely drew inspiration from this piece by Brahms, from the idea of a Chaconne, the initial long notes, the chords every other beat among the riches, in short a kind of your own reading (even if the reinterpretation was perhaps meant to be of Bach's prelude, and in fact I would have expected indications to that effect), etc.
Then you have a descending chromatic bass inherited from Bach (Brahms proposes it as an ascending motion, too different), harmonies that clearly do not hold up to comparison... at least in my opinion.
Aparte the initial rhythmlessness, look at how the orchestra moves after Brahms...
It could be that during orchestration, the fact that you don't have the guitar but the orchestra might allow you to bring out something pleasant... I would invite you to try it.
Evidently you only gave the correct information 7 hours ago... it's not like one lives on the forum... it's not a job... ok?
What does desire have to do with it? Having clarified this....
I just downloaded it... what is the point? And who fell into a trap regarding what?
Some preliminary considerations:
- a guitar cannot compensate for the timbral nuances of an orchestra... even setting aside the strings...
- the counter-proof of the uselessness of reading the score
- The already orchestrated intro is insufficient "on its own" to maintain that all those "guitar-like" arpeggios are of equal orchestratable effect (it is also true that we heard what Jean Françaix does with Chopin)
...could you please say clearly what you are alluding to or what eventually "annoyed" you about the comments you received on the piece ... to bring Brahms into it?
Oh finally something is moving.
You're right, I have been impatient
Practically, I don't want to say that the guitar can replace the orchestra, but that with the guitar one can perform a reduction of an orchestra and perhaps take inspiration for some variations.
The reduction is done by reading the score and trying to summarize the salient harmonies.
- The already orchestrated intro is insufficient "on its own" to maintain that all those "guitar-like" arpeggios are of equal orchestratable effect (it is also true that we heard what Jean Françaix does with Chopin
Striking arpeggios were only placed at the end... Are you talking about those arpeggios?
I wasn't annoyed by anything; on the contrary, they were quite valid reflections that made me think.
We were talking about Diesel, do you remember? I liked the fact that, anyway, a word was found to summarize the fact that the introduction is not all that interesting, also because it is 8 bars of minimal effort. Much like the 8 bars at the beginning of Brahms, of course they are not the same chords (and I believe so). However, an indirect judgment of Brahms' 8 bars emerged.
I suspect that Raffaele doesn't know what the month of May means to a student when you are enrolled in the new three-year programs
Turning back to the main point, aside from the chordal character of the intro... what is the point?
The point is that, in my opinion, by mimicking the greats a little, some lessons remain with you.
For example
Who knows how many times I've listened to that symphony, and yet only now do I realize how certain low sonorities were sought out in the "second variation (of Brahms)". The horn and the timpani and the string pizzicatos... all in the low octave... A rather lugubrious atmosphere.
You certainly drew inspiration from this piece by Brahms, from the Chaconne idea, the large initial notes, among the riches the chords are one quarter and one no, in short a kind of your own reading (even if the re-reading was eventually meant to be Bach's prelude, and in fact I would have expected indications to that effect), etc.
Then you have a descending chromatic bass inherited from Bach (Brahms proposes it as an ascending motion, too different), harmonies that clearly do not hold up to comparison... at least in my opinion.
Aparte the initial rhythm, look at how the orchestra moves after Brahms...
It could be that during orchestration, the fact that you don't have the guitar but the orchestra might allow you to bring out something pleasant... I would invite you to try it.
Great Abbot, you were the most attentive.. It is clear that you don't have exams in May
It is true that I did not stick to Bach. I wanted to do a rather strange exercise but one that would satisfy my curiosity.
It is true that the harmonic choices do not hold up to comparison... Who can say otherwise... I agree with you.
I also wanted to mimic the orchestration, partly because if you notice, at least 80% of the variations are rhythmically identical to the symphony. I just have to find the time to orchestrate... And it will be hard.
